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Cyclothymia - when does it become full-blown bipolar?

  1. Just been diagnosed as cyclothymic this week (Bipolar III to some). Am on anti-depressants and mood stabilizers. Currently hypomanic after major depressive disorder and nervous breakdown 3 years ago. Diagnosed with depression and borderline personality disorder. (oh, and OCD and anxiety taboot)

    I belive it is bipoloar II, not cyclothymia because I HAVE had major depression and was diagnosed with major depressive disorder, not mild to moderate depression as cyclothymia requires. Also, I have had a history of serious depressions and have been medicated for this a few times since early adulthood. Because of my unstable, rapid cycling moods, my initial diagnosis was borderline personality disorder. My psychiatrist said it was just me (my personality) and I would have to learn to live with it. He offered no help.

    What criteria must be reached in order to get a bipolar II diagnosis? Were 3 suicide attempts, 18 months of being mainly bed-ridden through depression and 2 years of therapy and drugs not enough to afford this diagnosis? I don't understand. Why won't my psychiatrist make a diagnosis? My GP diagnosed the cyclothymia.

    Please help. I need to understand.

    Potty P x

  2. May ask why you feel you need to have a diagnosis that say's you are suffering from Bi-polar rather than cyclothymia which most most people refer to as Bi-polar type 3. As long as you feel you are getting help does it really matter what "label" you put on your problem

    As you stated "My psychiatrist said it was just me (my personality) and I would have to learn to live with it. He offered no help" why don't you explain to your your GP how you feel and ask if it is possible to see a different psychiatrist.

    I have asimilar problem ans whilst some doctors / psychiatrist will "label" it Bi-polar type 3 others will give it no label at all but as long as I feel I am getting help I don't worry about it. Have you been offered Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) I found this a great help

  3. Hi John, Juliette here

    Thanks for your reply. It's good to hear from someone out there who's in a similar boat.

    You asked why I was so keen on a label. I fully accept what you say about the fact that it doesn't matter, so long as I am getting the meds and psych help I need, whch largely I am. My GP is my saviour as my psychiatrist doesn't really do anything. I've been with him for 3 years or so and have never had much help from him. I see him as a hoop to jump through to get referrals to psychology services.

    So, the label question: My husband and I are planning a pregnancy. As a diabetic this has to be planned! In order to give my baby the best chances of a normal development, I need to be off my meds. I've reduced them significantly and stopped my carbamazepine 2 days ago. The anti-ds are next on my hit list. Because of this, my moods are unstable and I feel I will need more monitoring and support, especially once pregnant when moods change in most mothers-to-be. My understanding is that those with a bipolar diagnosis have the best chance of access to the mental health services and that these will work in tandem with the diabetic services. Without a diagnosis, my choices will be limited. Furthermore, I may not get pregnant straight away, so could be off meds for nearly 2 years.

    You asked about CBT. I did that 3 years ago for about 18months, concurrent with EMDR therapy. It helped with the initial nervous breakdown, PTSD etc but was focussed more on dealing with depression, not moods. I bought a book on CBT yesterday to see if it could help me further. I am currently on a waiting list for DBT therapy which deals with problems on a more emotional level and is highly recommended for those with mood disorders. Again, a bipolar diagnosis and the fact that I'm off meds will hopefully get me that help sooner.

    Sometimes, you have to just jump through the hoops...such is life!

    Anyway, good to hear from you. I shall take on board what you said. Thanks again. Juliette x

  4. Hi Juliette

    If you go to this discussion on here

    http://www.patient.co.uk/forums/discuss/bi-polar-36555

    you will see I have put a much more detail reply and I think you will find some of the other replies helpful as well

  5. Hi potty p i can relate to your woes i to have only just been diagnosed after years and years of shinks dr and gps at least 4 suiced attempts and pretty much all drugs on the market relationships scupperd, i well done with your progress. i have been under the care of our outstanding NHs mental health teams in three different areas and i can only conclude the reason they find it difficult to diagnose is the fact they can only get there information from us and asking someone with bi p about behaviour patterns is fruitless as some days i can tell you what day it is let alone how i felt at a particuar time or day. i was very lucky to have a syc nurse visit me twice a week therfore my behaviour was easier to monitor and observe and what to look for where as the non pyc nurses are out of there dept bless um.

  6. Hi Seesaw

    Thanks for your reply. It seems that quite a lot of the population suffer with cyclothymia being misdiagnosed. Since my original post, I have bought a book on line (much cheeper than in the shops) called Cyclothymia Workbook. It explains symptoms, diagnosis, where it comes from, monitoring moods, addictions, medication, therapy etc. It's a self-help book which is actually quite helpful. I learnt about how often the condition is misdagnosed as it's actually quiet rare (only 4% of us have it). It also states that there is little research because of funding. Scientists would rather research full blown bipolar where they can see more obvious effects from their drugs!!!

    I've survived coming off the mood stabilizer by adding mega strength omega-3 and variious B vitamins to my diet. I've reduced my duloxetine anti-d from 120mg to 30mg. Since making this final reduction from 60 to 30mg I have felt a downward spiral again. I feel constantly tearful, tired, listless and have noticeably been binge eating and going on ridiculous shopping sprees. My husband says I'm more irritable and anxious and generally wired. I'm trying not to admit that I'm in a mixed state as this is quite dangerous. For the first time in 6 months I've thought I'd be better off dead. I've been hearing voices in so much as my own thoughts are not in my own voice. Is this normal or would this be a psychotic episode...again?

    I don't want to be on meds as I want to conceive a baby. I don't want to face the truth that I need them. I'm trying to ignore it but deep down I know that it's not good to ignore it and that I need to be honest with my GP. I just want my baby to have the best drug-free start in life.

    What would you do? Ignore the mood change or be honest with the GP? Help!

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